Forums » Spain » Relocation to Spain

• dnil

  
   

  July 3, 2008 1:39:34 PM CEST

  Hi there,
  we are a couple, I am Italian and my boyfriend is German, who is currently living near Zürich since three years.
  
  After several trials to live in a good way here in CH we are giving up and searching for a place we could call home. We would like to feel at ease with people, free to communicate and get in touch without the legal non-democracy which is the golden cage called Switzerland.
  
  I have been to Spain several times visiting Madrid, Toledo, Avila, Segovia and Barcelona and I found the people and places very friendly. Therefore in this moment of crisis I was thinking to search for a better life in Spain.
  
  Before beginning seriously to search for a job and study Spanish we would like to know about the life there.
  
  I began to read on forums about expat life in Spain and I was really surprised to find anti-foreigner attitude...
  I wouldn't like to fall again in a place where everyone is pointing you out because you are foreigner, where you lose the job because you are a foreigner, where you are continuously cross-checked because you are a foreigner, where you are rejected because you are a foreigner, etc... WE ARE ALL EUROPEAN!
  
  Well, as we both love the sea we would like to live in Barcelona but it seems that is a bit more difficult place compared to Madrid from job and integration point of view: is it true? What about Valencia and Malaga?
  
  We are both English speakers (and Italian, French, German... but willing to learn Spanish before coming!) working in IT/Telecom environment as Project Manager and Service Manager.
  
  Please let me know about your experience and your hints if you are living is these places... some more brainstorming would be much appreciated!
  
  Thanks a lot!!!
  ¡Muchas gracias!
• belerofonte

  
   

  July 8, 2008 7:35:43 PM CEST

  Hi D@nil@, i am a spanish guy, and because of my job i have been living in many different places in spain, and well, you will find friendly and open minded people as well as stupid and brainless people, like in any other place. When i read what you posted (we are all european!) you touched mi sensible side, i just think the same, but we have a long road to walk until that becomes a reality...
  If you have any questiion about life, job, people... just email me, lets see if i can answer it! my email is bestondoa@hotmail.com
• dnil

  
   

  July 11, 2008 4:35:57 PM CEST

  
  

  belerofonte (Jul 8 2008, 04:35 PM) said: > original post
  Hi D@nil@, i am a spanish guy, and because of my job i have been living in many different places in spain, and well, you will find friendly and open minded people as well as stupid and brainless people, like in any other place. When i read what you posted (we are all european!) you touched mi sensible side, i just think the same, but we have a long road to walk until that becomes a reality...
  If you have any questiion about life, job, people... just email me, lets see if i can answer it! my email is bestondoa@hotmail.com

  
  
  
  Hi Belerofonte,
  thanks a lot for your reply... I was thinking that nobody wanted to comment my post with ideas and experiences!
  
  Great! I will write you ASAP so that you have my email address as well ... but I think that maybe some questions I have could be useful to someone else with the same doubts so it would be nice to continue the information exchange on the forum, do you agree?
  
  Let's begin with a question on people and integration.
  You are right when you say that everywhere you find people more or less "brain gifted" but coming from the present bad experience in CH we wouldn't fall into another "cultural shock place" in which you are rejected only because your nationality is not the local one so that the integration is not possible unless you wear a mask and you behave exactly like they want you to behave.
  
  I mean, it's OK for me to "absorb" local way of living but this shouldn't forcibly cancel what I am.
  I have always been living in multi-cultural environment travelling a lot and having friends from a lot of different places in the world but I never had so many problems like here in CH.
  
  So, going back to Spain, I read some posts on which there were people having quite a lot of integration problems as well, also when speaking Spanish, therefore I decided to ask for opinions, from expats already living there as well as from Spanish.
  
  I am openly less concerned about me being Italian living in Spain than my boyfriend being German: for example, here I am treated often as a "poor lady coming from Italy who never studied" because historically a lot of my compatriots were coming from South Italy to CH just after the war to build roads, houses and carve caves, etc. so that the "second generation" of them is only able to speak dialect, Swiss and Italian from the place where they are coming from and the education level is unfortunately not really high.
  
  With Germans is a different story. Here they hate them! They unmounted part of our car, with German number plate, at work my boyfriend is mobbed just because of his nationality, in the train hearing that he was speaking High German instead of Swiss dialect they told him "Nazi Schwein" (literally nazi pork)... this I think is really not acceptable... there was also a German lady who tried to work on a local radio here in Zürich as deejay ... well, after they destroyed her car and sent her a lot of threats she decided to go back to Germany...
  
  Tell me that in Spain is not like this, please!!!!
  The image I have of Spain is completely different and people I met along my travels have always been lovely.
  I strongly believe in RESPECT, also to people who are not similar to me. It's a basic.
  
  Well I guess that as usual I wrote a bit too much but I think you can easily understand how I feel nowadays...
  
  I look forward to your comments!!! I have quite a lot more subjects to discuss...
  ¡Muchas gracias Belerofonte! ¡Hasta pronto!
• lee8

  
   

  July 12, 2008 2:50:29 PM CEST

  
  

  dnil (Jul 11 2008, 12:35 PM) said: > original post
  Let's begin with a question on people and integration.

  
  
  
  My wife is Basque, Andalucian mums took over 2 months to speak to her outside the school gates, two mothers became friendly one from the UK and one from Galicia.
  
  Spain`s many regions differ, its impossible to stereo type all Spanish as unfriendly/friendly.
  
  I fear if your looking for a country that welcomes all foreigners, you`ll struggle in any place on earth, humans are pack animals, we do not accept outsiders easily, sorry but its in our heritage.
  
  
  
  

  
  So, going back to Spain, I read some posts on which there were people having quite a lot of integration problems as well, also when speaking Spanish, therefore I decided to ask for opinions, from expats already living there as well as from Spanish.

  
  
  
  When you go to any region of Spain that has Expat`s in numbers, ask yourself why they surrounded by there fellow country men and bring the goods and services with them.
  
  On the costa del sol, germans live in urbs, estates that only germans live, all the nationalites do.There are Norweign, german, British schools, shops, plummbers,satellite installers etc etc.
  
  
  
  

  
  Tell me that in Spain is not like this, please!!!!
  The image I have of Spain is completely different and people I met along my travels have always been lovely.
  I strongly believe in RESPECT, also to people who are not similar to me. It's a basic.

  
  
  
  We have a saying in the UK, never bite the hand that feeds you.
  
  If your a tourist, of course they`ll welcome you, there taking your money.
  
  
  
  

  
  I look forward to your comments!!! I have quite a lot more subjects to discuss...
  ¡Muchas gracias Belerofonte! ¡Hasta pronto!

  
  
  
  If your Italian, ask some relatives, there opinion of foreigners moving into there country.
  
  i would suggest you read this site and others regarding Spain and problems, try to seperate from the people who retired to spain and the ones who only say the occasional Hola to a Spaniard.
  
  You need to listen to people who have moved to Spain, lived in Spain and worked in Spain.
  When i say in Spain, I mean within Spain, alongside Spaniards, simply being in the country isn`t going to give you a qualified insight into Spanish culture and attitude.
  
• evavelasco

  
   

  July 13, 2008 11:31:30 PM CEST

  
  Spaniards in general are very outgoing and friendly. Like everywhere else, you find nice people and people that are not as nice. The best thing in Spain is its quality of life, no doubt about it. Although being Italian you know that you have that too in there.
  
  Regarding expatriates, large cities like Barcelona or Madrid have large international communities, and I have not heard of "western" people being rejected. In Andalucia (including Málaga) and other regions, the community is smaller or very homogeneous (retired folks in Málaga, rich Germans in Mallorca).
  
  Work is tight in in most of Europe right now, so it is in Spain too. But, if you both are professional people and speak a bunch of languages, there will be no shortage of work for you.
  
  Good moment to rent or buy a home, as prices are down and there is a lot of competition.
  
  Good luck wiht your decision, let me know if questions!
  
  Eva - born and raised in BCN!
  
  
• dnil

  
   

  August 6, 2008 1:03:45 PM CEST

  
  

  lee8 (Jul 12 2008, 12:50 PM) said: > original post
  If your Italian, ask some relatives, there opinion of foreigners moving into there country.
  
  i would suggest you read this site and others regarding Spain and problems, try to seperate from the people who retired to spain and the ones who only say the occasional Hola to a Spaniard.
  
  You need to listen to people who have moved to Spain, lived in Spain and worked in Spain.
  When i say in Spain, I mean within Spain, alongside Spaniards, simply being in the country isn`t going to give you a qualified insight into Spanish culture and attitude.

  
  
  
  Thanks Lee8 for you comments even if I read a bit of black irony in your post, not only when you talk about German and English "ghettos" in Costa del Sol...
  
  I am trying to find another way to our life and for a list of reasons Spain in this moment is for us a possible solution.
  
  I am writing on this forum exactly to get impressions and tips from people living the local reality, Expats as well as Spaniards, as I don't know anyone (family or friends) to whom I can ask.
  
  After reading a bit around I am quite confident that we'll find in Spanish people very good friends and that the integration won't be a big problem, especially in places like Barcelona or Madrid or Valencia.
  
  So now I am going one step more: I need so much practical informations...
  Last week I got the first phone interview for a job in Barcelona and I was asked about the wage I would like to have... well, I had no clue!
  
  I don't know how the health system is working, pensions, taxes, how much is the average rent for an apartment...
  All really basic informations which can help to understand how the country is going and how much money is necessary to live a good life... and to evaluate if a job is good paid or not... I cannot compare the CH reality as the living costs here are most probably 3 times more than in S (as it is compared to I).
  
  Could you help me with these informations?
  Could someone reading this post send me more informations? Ideas? Impressions? Personal experiences?
  
  Thanks a lot for your help.
  
  D@nil@
  
  
• dnil

  
   

  August 6, 2008 1:31:18 PM CEST

  
  

  evavelasco (Jul 13 2008, 09:31 PM) said: > original post
  Spaniards in general are very outgoing and friendly. Like everywhere else, you find nice people and people that are not as nice. The best thing in Spain is its quality of life, no doubt about it. Although being Italian you know that you have that too in there.
  
  Regarding expatriates, large cities like Barcelona or Madrid have large international communities, and I have not heard of "western" people being rejected. In Andalucia (including Málaga) and other regions, the community is smaller or very homogeneous (retired folks in Málaga, rich Germans in Mallorca).
  
  Work is tight in in most of Europe right now, so it is in Spain too. But, if you both are professional people and speak a bunch of languages, there will be no shortage of work for you.
  
  Good moment to rent or buy a home, as prices are down and there is a lot of competition.
  
  Good luck wiht your decision, let me know if questions!
  
  Eva - born and raised in BCN!

  
  
  
  Eva thanks a lot for your reply!
  
  I much appreciated the positive message you gave me with your words. I feel for once encouraged to walk my road to Spain!
  
  After three yrs here in Zürich I am now higher evaluating the Italian quality of life... good life is not given only by a good wage or clean roads! I miss here colours, music, life, people laughing, free thoughts...
  
  I began to search for jobs in Barcelona and I got already a contact with a company: as I wrote in my previous post replying to lee8, I was asked about the wage average and I was not able to give a good answer...
  
  I miss really basic information on the living costs and the social system which are also helping to decide if a job is OK or not...
  
  How are health system, pensions, taxes working?
  How much is the average rent for an apartment?
  
  As you are "insider" in Barcelona reality (with an Italian expression I would say "BCN DOC" ) could you help me with these topics?
  
  Thanks a lot for your precious help!!!
  
  D@nil@
  
  
  
• danielcascales

  
   

  March 1, 2011 9:04:50 PM CET

  Hi D@nil@:
  
  I live in Sevilla, so I will tell you about beeing here.
  My mother is German but she came 50 years ago and the situation was different. Now you can find assholes like everywhere but its easy to avoid them. I would recommend to open your social net trough things different than your job. If you have any hobbys, leisure activities that might help you meeting people out of work, wich is a "war zone".
  
  Prices: a flat for a couple will cost at least, 500-700 euros a month. Prices have become crazy here. Your salary should be at least, 1000 euros a month, if both work you might come along with less, but try to earn more.
  
  I hope it helps you, best wishes,
  
  
  Daniel Cascales Speer
  www.southcontact.com